Goku/Freeza Namek Powers Debate

[Dagon]

We all know about Goku/150mil and Freeza 120mil and some people have a problem with it because Freeza seemed to put up a good fight until he started tiring. What are your thoughts about it? I see two ways to look at it:

1: Freeza is more than 120mil, up to 140 mil, then weakens to 120mil or less. Goku was at 150mil.

2: Goku was weakened when he turned Super Saiyan, making his power level less than 150mil, maybe 135 mil. Freeza is 120mil and weakens to about 90mil. When Goku heals and comes back from Yardrat, he is at 150mil or above.

I lean towards number 2 because Goku was far more beaten up than Freeza was when he turned Super Saiyan.

 

[Papasmurf]

I lean towards the former I suppose, though the Daizenshuu already has BS like Kami being at 220, Nappa being half of Goku's power and the Saibamen being 25% weaker than Raditz, yet being considered on par so I just don't pay it much mind.

I don't believe either of them had taken a hit to their powers by the time both reached their peak during the battle on Namek. Goku couldn't even swim ashore and had trouble keeping his eyes open after his fight with Freeza, but showed no signs of exhaustion after his transformation. I think if his power was decreased they would've made note of it like they did with his fights in the Cell arc. I also tend to think Freeza reached his maximum power despite his injuries, until the strain got the better of him.

 

[Lord Brofist]

The manga makes the implication that both Goku and Freeza are giving everything they have and wanting to test their full powers out against one another, especially Freeza. The thing is, if anyone is weakened, its Freeza.

Goku might have been on his knees for a bit but ultimately he was up and running again when he turned SSJ, showing no signs that he was out of breath or suffering from his wounds. Freeza on the other hand was nearly killed by the Genki-Dama earlier, took a beating from SSJ Goku and is now using a form that specifically hinders his stamina.

The simple fact that Freeza in this state of his can still rival Goku in power really indicates that the two relatively close to one another and while the outcome of the match may not change, you put Freeza at full stamina against Goku and the fight would most certainly last much longer.

Freeza was quite beaten up too but he could still use his full power, the same can be said for Goku as well.

The Daiz numbers just don't work. We've already seen multiple times of fights with a 1.3x gap (KK3 Goku vs Vegeta and Vegeta vs Cui) where each of these fights was an absolute slaughter in favor of one of the fighters.

Then here comes Goku vs Freeza, at a 1.25x difference we have Freeza trading blows with Goku, pushing him back and even taking the advantage at one point during the clash. And more so, this isn't like Freeza's fighting sills (Which Goku specifically notes needs improvement) or the fact that his endurance is letting him keep up.

Freeza is literally able to tango with Goku in this short amount of time. Compare that to say Vegeta whom under similar circumstances got violated by KK3 Goku and beaten so badly he puked up his intestines. And if anything else, Vegeta probably has more sills in terms of fighting capability as well.

Whether or not Freeza is at 140 million who knows, but putting him at the level he's at in the Daiz. is plainly insane.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Manga > Daizenshuu

The manga showed they're equal unlike the Daizenshuu has them far away each other.

 

[Pakl]

The Manga never showed they were equals

Freeza was able to hit Goku just twice and the rest of the fight was Goku having the advantage.. 130 million for Freeza

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

I doub that.

Goku struggles again in hand to hand combat against Freeza: <div class='spoiler_toggle'>Spoiler: click to toggle</div><div class="spoiler" style="display:none;">

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[Lord Brofist]

Not accounting Freeza's initial assault, since we know both fighters are holding back at that point.

Freeza hits Goku a total of five times. His attacks are short but hard hitting.

He fires down a Kaiai on Goku, bashes him through the ocean during the clash, elbows him him in the face, slams his hand down on his back and kicks him away.

Goku hits Freeza a total of around nine times, his attacks appear lighter but build up as combos compared to Freezas more hard hitting single attacks.

He headbutts Freeza, breaks his wrist and then swings him away (You might not even count the swing as an attack but for this sake I will) He knees Freeza in the face. He gut punches him. He kicks him and then he does a three hit comb.

There's a few short times where both contestants manage to dodge the others attacks as well.

In the end, Goku's advantage is notable but Freeza is clearly at a level that, especially for a guy whose body is being stressed out by a huge strain both physically and stamina wise, is capable of rivaling Super Saiyan Goku.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

That fight was just 5 minutes lol!

 

[Dagon]

If a moderator could edit the poll on this topic to remove the blank poll choices, that would be great.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Pm them buddy.

 

[Super Saiyan Overlord1007]

I don't see a problem with 150/120 mil. Goku laughs at Frieza's initial assault and the best thing Frieza ever did to Goku was the Nova Strike which caught him off guard and he got right back up after being drove into the ocean. For every time Frieza hits Goku he barely staggers and he immediately counters and Frieza is sent flying or is yelling out in pain.

 

[withheldforprivacy]

We all know about Goku/150mil and Freeza 120mil and some people have a problem with it because Freeza seemed to put up a good fight until he started tiring. What are your thoughts about it? I see two ways to look at it:

1: Freeza is more than 120mil, up to 140 mil, then weakens to 120mil or less. Goku was at 150mil.

2: Goku was weakened when he turned Super Saiyan, making his power level less than 150mil, maybe 135 mil. Freeza is 120mil and weakens to about 90mil. When Goku heals and comes back from Yardrat, he is at 150mil or above.

I lean towards number 2 because Goku was far more beaten up than Freeza was when he turned Super Saiyan.

SSJ definitely restored Goku, but there is no need to believe he was restored at full power. The idea of
Goku/Freeza being both weakened sounds fine, it also explains Trunkses feats without haxing Yardrat Goku.

 

[Lord Brofist]

I don't see a problem with 150/120 mil. Goku laughs at Frieza's initial assault and the best thing Frieza ever did to Goku was the Nova Strike which caught him off guard and he got right back up after being drove into the ocean. For every time Frieza hits Goku he barely staggers and he immediately counters and Frieza is sent flying or is yelling out in pain.

Freeza stated his initial assault was nothing more than a warm up. Even he wasn't being serious there.

Barely got staggered? I'm sorry did you read the fight the same fight my friend? Once Freeza decided to become serious, he put the pain on Goku. His worst attack, the Kiai, still made Goku grimmace in pain and grind his teeth and forced him to shield himself.

Every other attack Freeza sent at him that hit, sent the guy flying. He bashes him into the ocean (after taking on the KHH from a screaming, vein popping Goku) he elbows him so hard blood flies through the air and he sends Goku staggering. He takes a full punch in the gut, vomits all over and literally a panel later is smashing Goku down and kicking him away.

Every single time Goku attacks or gets hit, he's grinding his teeth, showing the sheer amount of stress on his face with each attack. Freeza's able to counter and dodge a few of Goku's attacks himself.

Every time someone says Goku was going easy or Freeza's attacks weren't doing anything, I honestly have to wonder if you guys are seriously reading the same fight because, anyone who reads this fight can see Freeza is beating the absolute crap out of Goku and the only difference is that Goku's beating the crap out of Freeza a bit more.