Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

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Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby withheldforprivacy » 24 Sep 2017, 08:01

-Statements: Goku (post 100x gravity)~Ginyu
-Scouters: Ginyu>>Goku (post 100x gravity)

-Statements: 3rd Form Freeza>=10x KK Goku (post 100x gravity)
-Scouters: 2nd Form Freeza>>10x KK Goku (post 100x gravity)

-Statements: Vegeta (post Zarbon)>=Nail
-Scouters: Nail>>Vegeta (post Zarbon)

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby GreatSaiyaman123 » 24 Sep 2017, 10:11

Both.

1) Ginyu was still holding back. Neither him or Goku were going all out, considering he estimated Goku's max (85k) to be below his true maz (90k)

Were 2 and 3 ever implied? I remember you making a post about Assault Freeza ~ K10 Goku, but could you refresh my memory here?
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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby Captain Cadaver » 24 Sep 2017, 13:33

Same as GS said. Example 1 is flawed as both fighters were holding back.
Don't remember there being anything to remotely suggest example 2, whilst example 3 is based purely on Vegeta's confidence against a heavily suppressed Nail who wasn't considered to be on a completely different tier from the other Namekians prior to showing his full power.

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby withheldforprivacy » 24 Sep 2017, 14:05

Same as GS said. Example 1 is flawed as both fighters were holding back.
Don't remember there being anything to remotely suggest example 2, whilst example 3 is based purely on Vegeta's confidence against a heavily suppressed Nail who wasn't considered to be on a completely different tier from the other Namekians prior to showing his full power.
1. It's not only their fight. There are three statements...
-Vegeta: It's Ginyu. I wonder whether you can handle him, Kakarrot.
-Vegeta: Kakarrot's and Ginyu's capabilities are practically the same. They might kill each other.
-Krillin: Goku, can you win again?
Goku: I won't know until i try.

Come on, if it wasn't for the scouter statements, everybody would believe Base Goku~FP Ginyu.

2. When Freeza transforms into the 3rd form, Goku states ''i might not be able to win, even
when i'm fully healed''. Later, Goku says ''i thought i had reached my limit before'', which
means he hadn't been counting on a zenkai.

3. If scouters readings are taken out, based on both Nail and Vegeta being confident to fight
each other, i'm sure everybody would believe they're close. Same case as everybody believing
Vegeta and Piccolo being close at Mecha Freeza Saga, because they were both confident to
start a fight.

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby Evil Vegeta » 24 Sep 2017, 14:17

Goku wasn't strong enough to break Ginyu's hold and even noted the "incredible power" of Ginyu in that moment. He needed a Kaio-Ken to escape it because Ginyu was too powerful.

So if anything, that, as well as Ginyu's powered-up Chi-blast imply Ginyu was the stronger of the two. Goku was just faster.

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby withheldforprivacy » 24 Sep 2017, 14:24

Goku wasn't strong enough to break Ginyu's hold and even noted the "incredible power" of Ginyu in that moment. He needed a Kaio-Ken to escape it because Ginyu was too powerful.

So if anything, that, as well as Ginyu's powered-up Chi-blast imply Ginyu was the stronger of the two. Goku was just faster.
Ginyu caught him because of Jeice's interfrerence. Also, that was a hold one can't break unless he has a huge power
advantage.

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby Evil Vegeta » 24 Sep 2017, 14:27

I just don't see the point in Goku noting Ginyu's incredible power if they're already comparable. The way he's stating it makes it seem as if he wasn't expecting Ginyu to be that strong.

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby Fearless 3:16 » 24 Sep 2017, 17:08

-Statements: Goku (post 100x gravity)~Ginyu
-Scouters: Ginyu>>Goku (post 100x gravity)

-Statements: 3rd Form Freeza>=10x KK Goku (post 100x gravity)
-Scouters: 2nd Form Freeza>>10x KK Goku (post 100x gravity)

-Statements: Vegeta (post Zarbon)>=Nail
-Scouters: Nail>>Vegeta (post Zarbon)
I'm curious about the first and third statements since I don't remember anything about it.

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby Goku9001 » 25 Sep 2017, 19:31

I don't recall any statement being made that implied that Vegeta was stronger than Nail.

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby Evil Vegeta » 25 Sep 2017, 20:06

There is none.

Only Vegeta telling Nail that standing in his way was suicide.

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby Fearless 3:16 » 26 Sep 2017, 14:51

How about the statement with Goku ~ Ginyu? Where was it stated?

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby Evil Vegeta » 26 Sep 2017, 20:20

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So more of an estimation.

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby Paladin » 26 Sep 2017, 23:51

They fought pretty evenly at first above the level of 60,000. Ginyu can control his battle power, so I don't see the problem with Vegeta thinking they're about the same.
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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby Evil Vegeta » 27 Sep 2017, 00:44

I guess the only funny part about it is Vegeta questioning whether Goku was capable of handling Ginyu, though that was probably just Vegeta throwing shade.

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Re: Freeza Saga: Statements vs scouters- what do you go with?

Postby Paladin » 27 Sep 2017, 00:56

He could also be referring to Goku being a softy. It's brought up a few times, even once by Ginyu.
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